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Post by GilmoreAngel on Mar 25, 2002 18:38:07 GMT -5
Starts now until Sunday at 8:30PM Pacific(I'll lock up the thread then)
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Post by Melissa on Mar 27, 2002 14:55:13 GMT -5
okay... im not rele sure how to start but here goes...
dean is better for rory because he loves her and treats her well
(now i guess a trory has to come and contradict my statement or something lol i have no idea)
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Post by Sara on Mar 27, 2002 15:19:36 GMT -5
yeah basically, the argument of the narco team is that Dean is the one Rory should be with not only because he loves her but she loves him as well. She has never shown an interest in Tristan...yes even with the kiss...need we remind the trories that in fact she left crying because it reminded her of Dean. Now I will not accuse Tristan of taking advantage of Rory-hey, he was dumped too- however, I will state that they were both vulnerable and the day that he and Rory talked about it he quickly stated that the kiss meant nothing. If he really had true feelings for her that he wanted to reveal why didn't he? When Dean was interested he told Rory.
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Post by GilmoreChica on Mar 28, 2002 20:13:00 GMT -5
[glow=red,2,300]I speak on behalf of the trories....I believe we all didnt realize the debate was THIS week....I looked in the rules, and now I am here posting. More from the trory team later.[/glow]
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Post by GilmoreChica on Mar 28, 2002 20:19:25 GMT -5
[glow=pink,2,300]in relation to Melissa's post, Tristan would love her and treat her well if he was given the opportunity and now, my first visual aid..... ![]() gland.netfirms.com/debate/trory/1.jpg [/img][/glow] |
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Post by Melissa on Mar 29, 2002 11:32:54 GMT -5
okay here's my rebut...
tristan was giving the opportunity and he was still a jerk...he was a jerk from the beginning so he just ruined his opportunities!
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Post by Sara on Mar 29, 2002 13:06:59 GMT -5
to back up what Melissa said...Tristan was given several opportunities to be with Rory. 1)In the Lorelai's first Day at Chilton he called her Mary and tried to hit on her hinting that basically all he cared to do was make-out with her, 2)at Rory's Birthday party if he would have been more sincere Rory would have been confused and chances are she wouldb have talked to him the beginnings of a friendship but he ruined that by being the jerk he is, 3)When he tried to ask her to the dance he should have been mch more courteous, even though she still wouldn't have accepted but at least she would have known that he actually wanted to take her, 4) He picked a fight with Dean at the dance and insulted her, so much for truly caring.5) lets just skip to the kiss, yes he kissed her and she kissed him back but the kiss reminded her of Dean's kisses so in reality Tristan lips on hers was not what was going through her mind. 6) When they talked about it he right away stated that the kiss meant nothing.7) When Rory said that he still wasn't over summer he should have said that no he liked her...after all she was single! He could have started as friends but no he ruined it.8) PJ HARVEY...his biggest opportunity...he came on too strong on her, he was a jerk...saying things like oh i give you permission and stealing her books...he should have said that it wasn't a date...a strictly friends concert trip. Instead he ruined his chances of ever being with her.9) and a final note on Runaway Little Boy...he didn't want to want to acknowledge that he kissed her and yes while he was heart-broken I guess over Rory and Dean that's no excuse to be a jerk. He was a jerk to her during rehersal and made it impossible for her to ever see him as a casual friend.
To sum it all up Tristan had several opportunities to go out with Rory or at least be her friend and start off slow...however, he ruined them by beinf a conceited jerk.
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Post by Sara on Mar 29, 2002 13:10:52 GMT -5
and in response to the picture....yeah he makes good eye candy but other than that? Its the quality of his character that's important...he comes across as an egotistical jerk. Sure he's cute but if only his looks transferred to his personality. Then he would be quite the guy. However, we aren't talkinf fanfic here but the actual show and Amy Sherman Palladino made this guy a jerk.
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Post by Princess_Ruby on Mar 29, 2002 20:58:07 GMT -5
i know i haven't been around much and i really don't have time to go through sara's entire post but here are a just a little tad of my opinion...
There was never solid proof that Rory ran crying from the kiss because it reminded her of Dean. And in that scene we see that Tristan does indeed have a really sweet side and that he is vulnerable. The only reason that he is such an idiot towards Rory is because she is different from all the girls that he is used to. She resists his advances because she is better than the bimbos that he is used to. He doesn't know how to act around her and is confused because he is used to having everything. However, if he didn't really like her and care about her, he would go through the trouble of chasing her the whole school year - making out with Summer on Rory's locker (obviously to make her jealous), going to the trouble of getting her those PJ Harvey tickets only to be rejected in front of much of the Chilton population. He does harbour real feelings for her and if she could see past the facade and the cockiness to the obvious caring soul within she would see that they are really compatible. Rory need somewho whom she can converse with intelligently, something that Dean can't offer her. Tristan has a guaranteed great future ahead of him, he will be able to enter college with her, because intelliectually and socially there are on the same level. They are obviously more compatible.
k well that's all for now!
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Post by Princess_Ruby on Mar 29, 2002 21:06:59 GMT -5
ok i just read all of the posts.
Tristan does come off as a jerk, i admit that. But we're not talking about how much of a jerk he is here, we're supposed to be talking about who is better for Rory. And just because sometimes he acts like a jerk (A.S-P did make him out to a total jerk, her dialogue and his actions created a complex character, not just a one-dimentional one. It is obvious that there is more to him than the cocky facade) doesn't mean that he is not compatible with Rory. In actual fact, he is a better match for her. He can be really sweet and since it is apparent that he really likes her, he would appreciate her.
As for Dean, he is sweet, i'll admit that. But he is too overprotective, jealous of Rory. He doesn't trust her enough and he doesn't understand her as well as he should (He broke up with her because she wasn't ready to say I LOVE YOU for Pete's sake!) He's not secure enough in thier relationship to let her interact with other guys (i.e Jess) and she is always having to explain herself to him, to calm him down.
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Post by Sara on Mar 29, 2002 21:19:22 GMT -5
If Tristan has so much as talked to Rory then he knows that Rory is not the type to get jealous because some guy she doesn't like is making out with some girl in front of her locker.
If Tristan decided to be smart he would drop the playboy facade and try to get Rory to see then real him. Instead of stealing her books and forcing himself on her. Rory isn't your typical teenage girl who swoons at a cute guy. So the whole I want to date you thing you should be happy cause I'm the most popular guy at school isn't going to work. Tristan doesn't really know who he is...he's a playboy the he's getting in trouble at school and then he's a nice guy. I agree that underneath he probably is a great guy BUT he isnot comfortable enough with himself to be compatible with Rory. Rory is a real girl and doesn't care what other people think and doesn't do what others would like her to do and Dean is also "real." He is comfortable with who he is and he doesn't pull any facades. He said he liked Rory from the beginning with the "your nice to look at" remark ( concerning when he saw her reading).
Just because Trisatn seems to have a guaranteed entrance into a university doesn't mean he'll go. Afterall he's in military school. He may be a smart guy but he hasn't displayed much sense. Also there is no evidence of his being able to converse with Rory intelligently
And Dean does converse with her intelligently. He's commented about her reading Hermann Melville...he read Jane Austen...but he was also trying to convince her to read other things too. He knows about Monty Python.
Dean doesn't have to be Rory's intellectual equal. He is able to offer her support and love. She fell for him for these reasons. He's attracted to her wit and intelligence among other things. They are in love. He doesn't need to be a male copy of her to make her happy.
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Post by Sara on Mar 29, 2002 21:27:03 GMT -5
And so it comes across from your argument that Dean doesn't appreciate her? He more than likes her he loves her.
Dean is protective yes, but the truth is that he's seen how other guys are drawn to her as well (i.e. Tristan, Jess). He knows Rory so well...like when she said she didn't want to look at the books anymore and even though he was bored he said it was alright. He is in fact secure with the relationship but he doesn't trust Jess. He is sure that Jess will get her into trouble. Much like Lorelai's own problems with Jess. However, he trusts her...he doesn't mind that she be friends with him but he doesn't have to like him.
Back to the point...Rory needs someone that will understand her...Tristan is puzzled by her. Dean does not have to be a male version of Rory to love her and for her to love him.
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Post by Melissa on Mar 29, 2002 22:49:42 GMT -5
well said sara!, i dont have anything to add!
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Post by Princess_Ruby on Mar 30, 2002 0:09:44 GMT -5
Well of course Tristan doesn't know Rory as well as he would like to, and he probably knows that she won't get jealous, but probably hanging on to small hopes he does it anyway. And as Paris said, Tristan has gone through a lot in his life and you can't just drop the sheild that you have had up for years at the flick of a hat. Of course Rory isn't the "typical teenage girl" (whatever that is!), but the times that Tristan did try to drop the facade, not for anyone else only her, and show his caring side, Rory tended to shun him anyway. Rory and Dean are "real" in their way because of where they were brought up, their family life. Tristan isn't used to that kind of life but because of his care for Rory, he tries to overcome that. And as for evidence of Tristan's intelligence - Rory admitted it herself. She said herself that he was smart. Also, it's not possible to survive at a school like Chilton without a high degree of intelligence, no matter how much money one has. And his conversation's with Rory did display intelligence. I never said that he is Rory's male counterpart, because he isn't. He is quite different from her, but they seem to able to teach each other alot. And is there something wrong with military school? I'm convinced that the reason that Tristan began to behave so crazily last season is because the show needed to get rid of him, and fast. So although he is in military school right now, he has too much of a social standing to deny himself a successful future.
As for Dean offering support and love, this is not always true. For the debutante ball, Rory had to bribe him (with BattleBots) to attend it with her, and also endure quite a bit of complaining on his part. He just broke up with her and showed no understanding when she didn't return his sentiments.
Just because he knows that other guys are drawn to her doesn't mean that he should go crazy the way he did when Jess bid on Rory's basket and won. He makes Rory feel guilty and asks her to give up on a tradition just because he is uncomfortable with Jess. He should trust her enough to know that no matter what Jess tries, she will keep control.
Rory does not need a male version of her but rather someone who will not rely on a simple three words to carry a relationship. She needs someone that shares at least some of her interests and beliefs as well as someone who will trust her.
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Post by Materialgrl82 on Mar 30, 2002 1:14:46 GMT -5
[glow=red,2,300] Disclaimer:I am temporarily filling in for Aj since she hasnt been here yet. If Aj does return before Shell locks this thread, I will return the posting right to her. I also give Aj permission to delete this post if she feels I stole her right in any way. Now that thats outta the way...moving on!
I guess heres my opening arguement--
"They're exactly the opposite and completely the same. Rory's alive and open, Tristan's broody and closed. Rory needs a stable relationship that tests her but doesnt provide things like jealousy. Tristan just needs a relationship exactly the same, serious, definitely not a no strings attached deal. He needs someone who depends on him, who needs him; and so does Rory. Its complex, but no one ever said love is easy."--Me!
My personal opinion, as to why I ever became a trory in the first place is pretty complex. I mean, obviously I was influenced by Chads good looks(who wouldnt be, look at the boy!) but thats not all of it by any means. Ive always been drawn to the classic idea of A Good Girl and A Bad Boy, horrible alliteration, but the cliche idea dating back to the '50's, stemming from James Dean primarily. I guess Tristan and Rory are a cliche, waiting to happen while part is already happening now. They have the love-hate relationship thing, and the difference in reputation. And you're always told "theres a thin line between love and hate." I dont think anyone can deny the tension and chemistry thats there(although that may be my jaded Trory-ness speaking), they challenge each other. Although this banter sometimes turns bitter, its clear Tristan has a soft spot for Rory in his heart, and in that heartfelt goodbye we saw replayed Tuesday, you can tell Rory will miss that boy terribly.  You can see the disappointment in her face. She believes in Tris, she knows he has potential and she tries to convince him that hes better than Duncan, Bowman and all the stupid shit they've pulled. I mean if Rory hated Tris like she told Dean in the public mauling episode..errr..I mean Love, Daisies and Troubadours, would she have tried to help him find ways to apologize.
Will be back in like 5 seconds with more...
~*Susie*
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&&~I've decided that im a narco but im in love with Tristan~
